“Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.”
King James Version (KJV)
Chris's comment on 2020-11-24 13:53:56:
Thank you Rev. Les for your thoughts on that matter. I must confess that I haven't given much consideration about "dreams" that come to us during sleep. I've always kept them separate from voluntary dreams (imaginations) to those that come to us involuntarily during sleep. But I can see what you're saying: that if our minds are so engaged (in this instance), in vile things while awake, then there could well be a reflection of this during those involuntary occasions. So, thank you for those added thoughts. Blessings.
Rev. Les's comment on 2020-11-24 09:35:03:
I am not sure I agree completely with Chris, and that's okay but here is what I see;
Middle voice from G1798; to dream: - dream (-er).
Is the middle voice of:
From G1722 and G5258; something seen in sleep, that is, a dream (vision in a dream): - dream.
So, it can actually be like daydreaming of evil things or actually sleeping and having evil dreams. Jude 8, using the word "Likewise" is referring to verse 7 about the filthy people in Sodom and Gomorrah. It compares these people not only to the Angels who left their first estate, the Jews that were destroyed due to unbelief, but to the sexual sins of Sodom and the surrounding cities.
If we are prone to Unbelief, Self Exaltation, or Dreams of Sexual Sins we must lay it before God and ask him to show us what is the root cause of these things. Confession and the power of the Grace of God can give us victory over these things. The Lord bless you both.
Chris's comment on 2020-10-20 23:55:25:
Jude, in this passage was writing in condemnation of those who perverted the Truths of God & that we Christians should recognize them & to "earnestly contend for our faith". He speaks of the history of the Israelites who were saved from Egypt but many of them sinned later in various ways (Jude 1:5); of the angels who left their first estate (Heaven), who sinned & are now held in chains awaiting judgement (v 6); of Sodom & Gomorrah who were given to licentious behaviour & homosexuality, now awaiting their doom in hell fire (v 7).
So, in like manner (v 8), these "filthy dreamers" (those men of verse 4, "who crept (into their fellowship) unawares"), also preach similar errors, who despise authority & governments & speak evil of things they are ignorant of (v 10). So, "dreamers" are people that have imagined themselves to be persons of great knowledge or reputation & so having a 'godly' authority to bring 'God's message', which of course was not so & contrary to Scriptural Truths. Today, we might tell someone to "dream on", if they come to us with some outlandish statement or belief that something wonderful is going to happen to them. These dreamers (& "filthy" is not in the original text but an adjective to describe their similarity to the other wicked people mentioned), were bringing messages coming from their carnal minds & hearts of pride, rather than Scriptural based.
wendy r's comment on 2020-10-20 07:15:29:
I am not sure what is meant by 'dreamers.' Is it those who are 'asleep?' Or is it those who are interpreting false dreams and saying they are prophecies? I just don't understand this. If someone could explain this verse, I would appreciate it. Thank you.